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Andrea Mitchell Reports

News/Business. Interviews with political figures with host Andrea Mitchell. New.

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Us 10, John Mccain 9, Washington 6, Cia 5, Egypt 5, Andrea Mitchell 5, Morsi 4, Clinton 4, Geico 4, Paul Ryan 3, Jay Carney 3, George W. Bush 3, Nbc 3, John Kerry 3, Scott Walker 3, Steve 3, Marco Rubio 3, Msnbc 3, Bruce 2, Schwab 2,
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  MSNBC    Andrea Mitchell Reports    News/Business. Interviews with political  
   figures with host Andrea Mitchell. New.  

    January 28, 2013
    10:00 - 11:00am PST  

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right now on andrea mitchell reports, finally a bipartisan path to citizenship for millions of undocumented militants. if today's senate plan survives. >> what's changed is there is a new appreciation on both sides of the aisle, including maybe more importantly on the republican side of the aisle, that we have to enact a comprehensive immigration reform bill. >> i'm cautiously optimistic. i see the right spirit. i see things that were once off the table for agreement and discussion, being on the table with a serious pathway forward. >> in rare accord the president is set to unveil a similar blueprint tomorrow, but today turned his firepower on guns. >> month group is more important for us to listen to than our law enforcement officials. they're where the rubber hits the road.
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>> was it an endorsement? the unprecedented joint interview that has launched a 2016 twitter storm. >> what's the date of expiration on this endorsement? >> oh, steve. >> you know, steve, i got to tell you, the -- you guys in the press are incorrigible. i was literally inaugurated four days ago, and you're talking about elections four years from now. >> and i am -- as you know, steve, i am still secretary of state, so i'm out of politics, and i'm forbidden from even hearing these questions. >> violence rages across egypt for a fifth straight day. we will have a live report. and brazil mourns more than 230 young victims of a horrendous nightclub fire as police make the first arrests. >> coulded gay. i'm andrea mitchell live in washington where he begin with breaking news today. word exclusively of what could be a major policy shift on access for gay youths to the boy
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scouts. nbc justice correspondent pete williams joins me now from the newsroom with the latest on this exclusive story where are pete. >> the boy scouts are considering dropping their national ban on gay scouts or gay scout leaders, and that would be a profound change for an iconic american organization, one that has resisted this for several decades. the policy is now under consideration by the board's national -- the organization's national board of directors. if adopted, it would remove this requirement from the national organization and leave it up to individual scouting organizations whether to admit gay scout members, gay scouts, or scout leaders. these individual troops are, as you know, sponsored by civic and charitable organization and religious institutions, and if this policy was approved, each individual chapter would decide for itself, each individual unit would decide whether to admit gay scouts and then parents
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could decide for themselves where to send their children. now, the board -- the scout's board of directors meets next week, so it's possible that this change, if it's approved, could be announced as early as then, but this is highly controversial, but a scouting official says that the consideration of this change is something that's coming from the grassroots level, that individual chapters have urged the boy scouts to reconsider this position. something that they announced just last july. they were reaffirming their old policy. this would be a po found change, andrea. >> and, pete, just to explain how profound a change, just very, very recently a boy scouts troop here, not far from the nation's capital in cloverly, maryland, had a nondiscrimination policy, and it said pack 442 will not discriminate against any psychiatried or family based on race, religion, national origin, or sexual orientation, and the national boy counties made them take that down if their website. >> you know, i'm not sure
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whether it was the national organization or the national capital organization. the sort of local umbrella organization for the scouts. they were urged to conform to the national policy. they've been enforcing the national policy at the same time that knee had active consideration of change it. the change is coming both from the grassroots level and from the top as well. two members of the board of directors, the ceos of at&t and ernst and young have publicly said this he they think this policy should change, and during the last presidential campaign both barack obama and mitt romney also called for a change of policy. >> the times, they are achanging. pete williams, thank you very much. look forward to more of your reporting on this important development. today, a major breakthrough on immigration reform. leading senators from both political parties to agree on a path to citizenship combined first with stronger border security. joining me now for our daily fix, chris calizza, managing editor of post politics.com,
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chuck todd, nbc news chief white house correspondent, political and host of the daily rundown, and telemundo jose diaz ballard. first, chuck todd at the white house. the president is going to las vegas tomorrow and is making a speech and jay carney has just said that his policy prescription, they don't have specific legislation yet conforms with what the senate negotiating committee. this is an important development. >> that's the news right out of this briefing. >> would the president offer his own plan, a detailed bill he would want to move separately? as late as last week there was some speculation about that, congressional hispanic caucus met here with the president at the white house. they said let this gang work, and that's the message from jay carney. under a number of questions talking about, well, there's a difference here between what the president wants and what this group of eight wants, and jay
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carney said let me show you all the areas they agree, and the president will talk about -- talks tomorrow, andrea, in saying continue a conversation with the american people about immigration. >> let's talk chris and jose about the elements of this plan. we are talking -- if we could put it on the screen about a detailed plan that basically includes the path to citizenship, border control, combatting visa overstays, improving the legal immigration system, awarding green cards to immigrants with ph.d.s and degrees, something that the business community strongly wants, illegal immigrants have to pay their fines, back taxes, helping businesses hire low skilled workers. this is a really comprehensive package. jose, first of all, how is this going to be purr received in the community? >> extraordinarily well, andrea.
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good afternoon. as a matter of fact, this issue is of vital importance to literally millions of people in the united states. we have to remember that for the past four years there have been a record number of deportations under the obama administration. record now 1.8 million people have been deported. the border is more secure than it's ever been in o'our recent history, and the fact of the matter is that something like this which deals with issues like the border, it deals with what to do with the broken legal immigration system, both sides agree that it's broken, but also deals in a humane matter with 11 million people who are here without their documents and who have been here for many years, many of them have children here, have grandchildren here and have contributed to this society and to this economy for many, many decades.
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this is something extremely well received. >> the politics of this, republicans as john mccain was the first to say yesterday, republicans have to deal with the facts of life here. now, ironically, if john mccain and lindsey graham and others had joined with george w. bush, this could have been done in 2007. >> right. what john mccain sort of didn't say but implied was what has changed about this issue? it's simple. november 6th, the 2012 general election. the overall share of republican votes was -- people that voted for republicans is white. 11% nonwhite. it is -- that is an untenable -- we saw in 2012, and it will only get worse if they continue to lose 70% plus of the hispanic vote. that's what's changed here. republicans broadly recognize it. the question is jose touched on it, the path to citizenship.
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that is the piece that is always the one that conservative republicans said we will not do this. we are validating illegal behavior, no matter what we do. now there are some republicans on board. marco rubio, john mccain, lindsey graham saying, look, this has to be in the proposal. can they rally republicans in the house and senate behind the political necessity of putting immigration reform behind them with a path to sit sfwlenship or not? that seems to me to be the rub. >> with 2016 on their minds, we can also talk about the unusual joint interview the president and secretary of state hillary clinton and her last week in office jointly being appearing on "60 minutes." chuck todd, this was not an endorsement, they all say. it was a thank you. it was an interesting development to see these two together after aall that had proceeded in 2008. i was fascinated by this part of the interview where they were asked by steve croft about the residual resentments by staff
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and spouses that last lasted longer than the principles. let's watch. >> we both built some pretty thick skins. you know, sometimes our staffs don't go through that. they are taking umbrage and offense. hellry handled this, i assume as i do, we have a block, a screen, from a lot of the sillyness that happens during presidential campaigns. >> what about the spouses? is that an impertinent question? >> what i was going to say is having been a spouse and having been a candidate, i think spouses take it much harder. >> so, chuck, how is joe biden feeling today? >> we're trying to see if they peeled him off the ceiling after he found out this was going to happen. >> the reason the president wanted to do this, and the reason he thought he owed her a public thanks is i got two names for you. john mccain, the other is ted
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kennedy. ted kennedy was a thorn in jimmy carter's side. kept the party pretty divided in times in the late 1970s. john mccain and george w. bush, very bad relationship in that first term. made getting some things done on capitol hill very difficult. difficult at times for george w. bush to unite his party sometimes, but even unite independents, and what did obama not want? that same issue, and that's why he wanted hillary clinton in his cabinet, in his white house, so he didn't have that. it kept the party united. that's what he was thanking her for more than anything else, which was sort of thank you for keeping the party united and not going to senate, which would have been, you know, think about every moment in the obama first term and what life would have been like for him with a senator hillary clinton. >> and what about the -- the reaction to this whole drama, 2016, jose, already.
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i know it's way too soon, and we all vowed we wendt do it, but seeing the two of them together, that does get people talking. >> you know, andrea, i'm so sorry. i'm having a real problem listening to you. not that i don't want to listen to you and to our friends here tonight. i just cannot understand -- i'm having a problem with audio. >> with audio. we are so sorry. >>. >> a good 2016 answer, actually. i think that's a perfect answer. >> can i say one thing that i thought hit home. i will say your spouse takes it more seergsly. i'm fine with people attacking me. if people say something bad about my wife, i get very up in arms, i actually thought those were human moments and very true to any of us that you are okay taking some incoming yourself, but when the spouse takes incoming, you kind of get your hackles up. i thought that was a nice moment for both of them. i have 234e6r pledged to say
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it's too soon to talk about 2016, and i never will make that pledge. >> i can relate to all of that. everything that you said. >> yeah. >> okay. thank you all very much. >> talk to you again soon,and, of course, chuck and chris. joining me to talk about the senate breakthrough on immigration, janet, president and ceo of the national council and joining us from kansas city, missouri -- well, what do you think so far? this does sound like more bipartisan agreement more than we've seen on this issue. >> without question. we're thrilled and delight that we've seen such a strong start to 2013. >> i would like to say we've been waiting for this moment for a long time, but the reality is that we created this moment. many of us in the hispanic community and immigrant communities i know have been working hard through the civic engaugesment process and in november i think we made a lot
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of this happen, and i'm pleased the result has been bipartisan effort and really want to commend both the president and his strong stand and making sure -- also for the bipartisan leadership we've seen in congress so far. it's really exciting, and there's a lot of energy around this. >> we hear from republican leaders like john mccain that they acknowledge that the debate during the debates in the primary season and the republican party really alienated the latino community. is there awe way that they can regain your confidence and trust with actions stuch as this? >> this is an important step in the right direction. there's no question that the republican party needs to think about rebranding itself with the latino community, and this effort is going to be a very important effort to do that.
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they went to the booth with the economy on their minds, but with immigration in their hearts, and this is going to be a really important step for them to rebrand themselves with the hispanic voters and with hispanic constituencies. >> we saw some of the language during self-deportation and some of the reactions of some of the candidates. not only the leading candidates, but the other counties. just really pull the party in one direction. marco rubio, i know, from a press breakfast and on the record session that we have with him was prepared to offer a modified immigration plan and you couldn't even get a meeting with the official republican ticket. the president came out with his dream act changes and that trumped the republicans on it.
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>> yes. the election was transformational in terms of the message that hispanic voters set, but also i think it's important for people to understand that this has -- immigration reform has broad support by the american people. i think republicans have gotten that message. i do think individuals like senator john mccain for saying today and over the weekend and working hard -- i commend voices like marco rubio for doing the same thing. it's important for us to see the president, leaders in the senate and the house as we heard earlier. i think we're seeing bipartisan efforts in the let's head outside that are going to start to surface, and i think it's all a reaction to the notion that the american public really does want to see immigration reform.
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certainly latino voters have said that we expect to see immigration reform and i think we're going to see for the first time a real effort to achieve that in this year, and we're going to be moving in a direction as hispanic voters and constituencies to hold those members accountable. i mean, our work is not done. it wasn't done on election day. we're going to continue to monitor and hold those key members accountable for this, and that process is going to continue. >> it's the power of the ballot box. janet and a lot of organizing. thank you very much. >> thank you. coming up next, facebook co-founder and the new publisher of the new republic. chris hughes. his big interview with president obama. join us wednesday for our interview with secretary of state hillary clinton as she finishes her final week at the state department. that's this wednesday at 1:00 eastern right here on andrea mitchell reports. hungry for the best? it's eb. want to give your family the very best in taste, freshness, and nutrition?
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>> president obama says is he committed to entitlement cuts along with new revenues, though, and in the wide ranging interview with the new republic, discussed a budget deal. he also talked about everything from skeet shooting at camp david by his guests to how he would feel about letting a son play football if he had a son. chris hughes, the new publisher of the new republic, and a pound founder of facebook as well as an obama supporter joins me fro new york. it's great to see you again. what was your take-away from this? i was very struck by the fact that, well, he -- the president seemed to be sending a very tough signal on entitlements and on the budget in the inaugural speech. he was much more conciliatory in your interview. >> it was really interesting. throughout the conversation it
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was clear when his tone when it came to the congressional republicans changed. four years ago he seemed to move to compromise very quickly, and now when it was in our interview and more just generally, he took a much more strident tone. he specifically said that he felt that boehner and the house republican leadership was probably more moderate than some of the other elements in their party, and it was a real roadblock in trying to get anything done. when we talked about why it is so difficult, we talked about some of the constitutional challenger, and filibuster reform in the senate and secondly the media in saying that, you know, rush limbaugh and the fox newses of the world keep the pressure on the house and congressional republicans and they're so strong about it that it makes it difficult for him to actually have a meaningful conversation or find common ground. >> i thought it was unusual that
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he called out fox. that was a prompt? is that something he came up with himself? >> no, it was actually -- one of the questions that i asked was it was inspiring to a lot of people. i asked if he felt like four years later the environment in washington seems more nasty than ever had he been able to usher that in, and one of the two reasons that he felt like it had been a challenge was of the media. i think the larger point that he was trying to make was that the media is becoming increasingly skewed over the past few years. we toned listen to the people we agree with, rather than the people that we disagree with, which makes it more difficult to find common ground in a place like washington.
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>> he did say it's one of the practices by his guest, but that doesn't mean that we need assault weapons is basically his point, i guess. >> yeah. well, i mean, frank, the editor of the new republic asked him point blairnk have you ever fired a gun, and he said, yeah, we go skeet shooting all the time up at camp david. he and his guests, which was news to us and news to a lot of people. i think he did seem very intent on trying to bridge the divide between gun owners and those that don't. it was a telling sign that he says he is a gun owner and shoots himself. >> and on football, he said he would have to think long and hard before i let him, some notional son, play football. he is concerned about the head
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injuries and how damaging this has been to young and adult football players. >> yeah. this was a really interesting moment in the interview because we spent a good bit of time with him in sort of classic obama style. he spoke very carefully and at times very slowly throughout the interview, but on this question about football, there is zero hesitation. i mean, he was very clear that if he had a son, he would have some serious concerns about allowing him to play football. he went on to make a distinction between football players at collegiate level and professional saying that professional ones are well compensated, they're grown men who can make the decisions for themtsz, whereas those in college, it's -- you know, it's a little bit more questionable the extent to which they're really beating up their bodies in the process. there is clearly attention. he loves the sport, as do many americans, but there are some
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questions that he was certainly concerned about personally. >> it also, by the way, came up with hillary clinton in her interview on "60 minutes" with the president. she is more aware of the concussion she suffered and the still lasting effect on her vision. thank you very much. congratulation on the new republic. we're all very excited about it. >> thank you. >> and up next, republican soul searching with former party chair michael steel. >> and still ahead, the crackdown on leaks at the cia. stay with us. at a dry cleaner, we replaced people with a machine. what? customers didn't like it. so why do banks do it? hello? hello?! if your bank doesn't let you talk to a real person 24/7, you need an ally. hello? ally bank.
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november. rooirn made it clear that he wants to help revive the republican party. he certainly took a step towards that in williamsburg. joining me here in our studio is michael steel, msnbc chair analyst and former chair of the republican national committee. it was paul ryan that tried to bring them back from the wilderness by saying let's not fight over the debt ceiling and procedural matters. let's have our big fights about substantive budget issues down the road. trying to tell the more adamant tea party members that they have to get real if they're going to win again. >> i love the fact that paul ryan is emerging as that voice that's going to sort of shape and form the ground on which this new effort by the party will stand. here's the dance. the dance, though, is the rhetoric is one thing. you have the washington class talking and saying what we have to do, and we're going to do this, and rubio and the crew are going to roll out on immigration
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issue today. that's all great. how does the typical tea party activist respond? are they ready to make that move? do they believe that it's credible? do they believe that this undermines or augments our principles and what they believe and we believe to be an important part of this discussion as much as the effort at outreach and the effort of making the right soundbyte. have to marry that up. there's one thing for the leadership to go out and say this is what we need to do and we're going to do, and about i god the base is going we're not with that program. they're going to have to bring those synergies together. if they don't, you're going to continue to see this friction at the grassroots from the grassroots level with the leadership of the party? >> you've got governors and there's so much happening with scott walker and bobby jendahl and the other governors around the state who are taking very strong positions, but also trying to deal with economic issues that are of great
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concern. bobby jindahl said we have to stop being the stupid party. it's time for a new republican party that talks like adults. he is talking about the todd akin's of the world. the reaction to him -- >> has been mixed. some members of the audience are like, really, we're not about that. they were not feeling his vibe on that. governor jidahl is consistent with what we did during my time at the rnc, which i got a lot of resistance to as i always said. let's get out of our comfort zone. let's go and be where the community of people are, understand what their issues rshgs and then take our philosophy and our view and our values. embrace those experiences. show them why they're a value to them. why our values are a value to the american people. i think the laebtory is in the states where republican
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governors are governing, and they can put them to practice those principles as we saw with scott walker. god bless scott walker in his ability to stand firm on those principles and move the people to his view and position on why the economic strategy and approach he was taking was important for the longer term health of his state. those are the good examples of success -- those governors in very tough states for republicans by and large are doing well because they have married up those principles with the policies in a way that the american -- that the people in their state appreciate. not just the activists in the party. >> thank you very much. the state of emergency in egypt. we'll be live in cairo. >> how could the political unrest in egypt impact president obama's second term? you're watching andrea mitchell reports only on msnbc. [ coughs ] [ angry gibberish ]
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sdwleerchlgts as violence continues for the fifth straight day across the country. an opposition leaders have rejected president morsi's sunday night call for dialogue. so far the political crisis has left 50 dead and many more injured. nbc's amman mojadin joins from yous cairo. is there any resolution in sight, or is this thing still escalating? >> reporter: well, right now the situation remains extremely tense. in fact, a short while ago you can probably see it in those pictures tahrir square. they set this on fire as thousands cheered on. in the cities of -- in fact, in about two hour's time from now, we are expecting actually less than that, we are expecting a
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curfew to go into place. that is because yesterday president morsi declared a state of an emergency in three cities along the suez canal. he deployed the military and imposed at least emergency law. it gives you a sense of how -- a political uncertainty as well. as you mentioned, the country's leading political opposition figures have rejected calls for a national dialogue. the protesters and the opposition want president morsi to anull a recently approved constitution and to create a new national unity government that includes members of the opposition. so far there's no indication that president morsi is going to abbing employee ens to those demands, and he feels he has a mandate to push ahead with his current jaebd agenda. >> thank you very much. in his "60 minutes" interview the president responded to the criticism that his administration has been reluctant to engage in foreign crisises like syria. watch. >> we helped to put together and
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lay the ground work for liberating libya. you know, when it comes to egypt, i think had at any time been for the leadership we showed, you might have seen a different outdoom there. >> joining me now is the atlantic's jeffrey goldberg, and the washington post and karen --. jeff, first to you. you've just come back from the middle east. i was wondering as i watched that what was the president doing describing either libya or egypt as a success story for american intervention? >> well, it could always be worse, i suppose, but it's not -- you can't call either of these places success stories. obviously, libya has turned into a semi-disaster. obviously egypt is not going very well at all. i mean, the larger point is and the question that maybe could have been asked a little harder is you have a situation now that syria could be a safe haven for
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al qaeda type organizations. mali, obviously, has become one. pakistan continues to be a place where these groups exist. afghanistan, there's no guarantee of the future. these are -- the foreign policy record, especially as it relates to terrorism, is not much of a record. >> and caryn, you've been covering the foreign policy as well as the domestic policy. this "60 minutes" interview, the joint interview, was pretty extraordinary on the face of it, but as we enter this last week of hillary clinton's tenure, the president is basically saying, you know, thank you, thank you, thank you for everything you've done. >> yeah. and she has been i think in many ways -- there are not a lot of sort of big monumental tangible accomplishments of her tenure as secretary of state. in many ways she was successful as much because of what she represented, but the history of second terms is that foreign policy becomes much more
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important, that presidents travel more, that they often engage more with the rest of the world, and i think that given the set of events we're looking at overseas, that is very likely to be the case of president obama's second term. foreign policy almost wasn't even almost mentioned in this election, you know, until benghazi at the very end. i think that, again, i think it's going to become much more a part of the maretive in the second term. >> and chris, today on the hill this big immigration announcement. this is really the first bipartisan venture, and now the white house announced within the hour that the president is in sync with them and is going to follow the preceps that they are on a parallel path here. >> that's right. this bipartisan group of heavy-hitting senators made hur to put on the their announcement today ahead of the president's announcement in nevada tomorrow to show that there's bipartisan supports, to make sure that they
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didn't look as if they were following the president, which wouldn't be good for republicans in the group. while there is momentum among the elite in washington, we're not sure how this will play outside yet, and we saw back in 2007 you had ted kennedy aligned with the senate on the democratic side. you had john mccain on the republican side. the maverick came together and mccain got crushed on this issue. it was very damaging to him both in his presidential and also in his senate re-elect, so i think it's what's important to watch here as the immigration stuff unrolls this week. it's how are grassroots particularly conservatives reacting to these proposals. >> and the next big step coming up we've got a vote in the senate foreign relations committee tomorrow on john kerry. that's going to be automatic. he is going to be breezed
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through and voted for and hillary clinton leaves friday. he will be coming in next monday. let's talk about chuck hagel and his confirmation hearing is on friday. you're just back from israel. what is the view there now? >> well, the israelis are very cautious about not saying anything. you know, there was this whole business about interfering about the netanyahu government. they're being hyper cautious about not saying anything. that said there's a lot of worry that he is you're going to distance or work to distance the united states from israel, and that's kind of right beneath the surface. i don't think it's true, but i think this is what the worry is. >> today the president called benjamin netanyahu to congratulate him on his majority. >> i'm looking forward to their joint interview on "60 minutes." that's going to be very cuddly, i'm sure. >> at the same time do you think that a john kerry state department is going to be more engaged in trying to push the israeli-palestinian track, or
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does everything now depend on what happens in egypt? >> this is very interesting. there's going to be a lot of pressure on president obama from everyone from the king of jordan to the british prime minister. >> there already is. >> to really make a push. john kerry very much wants to make a push, and this is interesting because, you know, he looks at hillary's record, which is a fine record, but there is no signal achievement. obviously the middle east peace is the big emchilada, and he is very interested in pursuing that. i think the president is worried about pursuing it because he doesn't want to go down this path and spend political capital on something that's not going to work. >> jeffrey goldberg, safe travels back. i'm glad you're home. thank you very much. and karen and chris, thanks again for being with us. coming up next, the cia star who is now headed to jail for leaking classified secrets. says it may help lower cholesterol, how does it work? you just have to eat it as part of your heart healthy diet. step 1. eat the soup. all those veggies and beans, that's what may help lower your cholesterol and -- well that's easy
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john will soon be the first cia operative to go to jail for leaking secrets to a reporter.
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he pour trays himself as a whistle blower who exposed waterboarding, but prosecutors say he betrayed his former colleagues. bruce rydell is a former cia officer now with the brookings institution and a former colleague as well. you have written to the president, bruce, asking him to commute this sentence. it's a 30-month sentence. why? given what i read and what i heard the judge say, the judge said she thought 30 months was not long enough. what the prosecutor neil mcbride said is that he was originally charged with other charges of disclosing names, and the picture of this one cia officer was found in the jail cell of one of the guantanamo suspects. >> hi, andrea. i'm want here to relitigate john's trial. he pled guilty to one instance of giving the name to a cia operative. many of us who signed the letter
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believe that this should be put in perspective. john is a cia officer who served very bravely for his country for more than a decade overseas. in some of the most dangerous places of the world. he most notably led the team that went in and captured abu zubada in 2002. the first senior al qaeda figure captured after 9/11. the capture of el zubada was critical to the line of captures that ultimately led to the death of osama bin laden. secondly, there is precedent here for commutation of this offense. four years ago -- scooter libby had leaked the name of a cia officer valley plame to the press. i would say he did it deliberately and i would say maliciously. that did badly damage a cia
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operational capability. yet, his sentence was commuted. let's put john's situation in some perspective. does the punishment fit the crime here? i think he has already been punished a lot. he has incurred tens of thousands of dollars in court expenses. he has lost his job. does it really make sense to send an american serve 30 months in jail? i don't think so. and a number of other people including a dozen other former cia officers have asked the president for mercy, for compassion in this case. >> let me play just a little bit of a "today" show interview that is a van savannah guthrie did with him this morning. >> you're saying the government, the practices in your view were torture. you said that officials high in the government authorized themment you also said they worked. in fact, in 2007 you told msnbc,
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you were coming forward then because you thought that the agency had gotten, quote, a bum wrap on waterboarding. that's somebody defending the practices, not denouncing them. >> i did in the beginning because i was relying on what the cia told officers inside the building, that the methods were effective. that turned out to be a lie. >> now, that shows that there's been a lot of confusion back and forth. but i guess one thing that comes through here is the agency do you think and is the justice department trying to make an example of him in this crackdown on leaks which we are seeing in other instances, as well? there are a lot of cases pushed by the justice department, more so than in prior administrations. >> and i think that the government has every right and every obligation to do what it can to maintain the secrecy of cia operations abroad. don't get me wrong. i think that leaking the names of cia officers is a very
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serious offense. i have served undercover for my country, as well, and i wouldn't want it happening to me. this president rightly decided to outlaw torture. and to close down secret dark prisons. i think those were the right things to do. he also decided, again rightly in my judgment, not to prosecute those who had been involved in the operations because, after all, those operations were ordered by his predecessor, george bush and dick cheney. it's deeply ironic then a person who's spoken out against torture, who has cried out that his conscience said this was the wrong thing to do is going to be the only prisoner who goes to jail in the obama administration for issues surrounding the use of torture. this is a progressive, liberal, democratic administration. i supported it. i helped to get barack obama
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elected in 2008 and i continue to support him today but i don't think that it's a good fit for this administration to send to jail an american hero who has worked against torture when those who carried out torture aren't going to go to jail in the future. it just doesn't add up right, andrea. >> thank you very much, bruce. good to see you. thank you for joining us. we'll be right back. tt=eá7bhppm5
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and that does it for us for this edition of "andrea mitchell reports." tamron hall has a look at what's next. hi, tamron. >> great to see you. in about 30 minutes, a bipartisan group of senators will lay out an immigration overhaul. nbc's first read says it's the first senator mccain signed on to a top obama administration priority since the president took office and may be the most serious bipartisan effort to act
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on immigration since 2007. all the reaction for you. plus, what could be a major policy shift for the boy scouts and the ban on gay scouts and leaders. our "gut check." what do you think was the motive behind this extraordinary joint interview? we'll tell you how you can weigh in. mom? who's mom? i'm the giants mascot. the giants don't have a mascot! ohhh! eat up! new jammin jerk chicken soup has tasty pieces of chicken with rice and beans. hmmm. for giant hunger! thanks mom! see ya! whoaa...oops! mom? i'm ok. grandma? hi sweetie! she operates the head. [ male announcer ] campbell's chunky soup. it fills you up right.
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